If you purchased any of the 199 passes CHECK YOUR CREDIT CARD.

Due to an internal accounting error @ Snowshoe, they hit my acct for the orig purchase on 2/22.

Then again on 3/4, then again this morning (3/5)

They are hoping to correct this by weeks end.

I'll give ya $75 for one of those extras

75 * 3 = 225. I guess it was a 3 yr pass

Their facebook page is going to blow up today.

I have a guys direct # in accounting but it would be just cruel to post it.

Well, that's one way for Snowshoe to recoup some of the losses they may incur from charging only $199.

Thanks for the head-up, BlueDon. Will check my bill.

Woody

I wasn't double billed but went to pick up my pass on Friday only to be told they were out of the stock needed to print them. Turns out they sold 15,000 of the passes. Got comp tickets for my skiing. I doubt I'll be back again before the end of the month so I guess I'll pick it up this summer.

...15,000 passes x $199 = $ 2,985,000 ...someone working for snowshoe had a good idea...I guess it pays for owners to listen to the folks who work for them...hiring people to do a job and make you money, letting them, and then offering opportunities for advancement so they can make you more money---what a novel concept...

How they make money(?). If you DIDN'T buy the pass you'd be getting Package deals on lodging that includes lift tickets. Now, with that Pass, you may have to pay full rack rate for "just lodging"....their computerized system may determine if lodging is "available" for who and how much, the same as how I get rooms in my regular hotels at are "sold out". It was a deal for Owners (though I passed as I quit going even with an empty condo) It'll be interesting to see next year how it adds up in the end. Correct my math, but there are "X" amount of beds available, so makes no difference how many they sell (pure profit), as everyone that bought a pass can't show up....though from the looks of Ballhooter they did! LOL

I agree that a large portion of the purchasers were owners and their families in addition to those who simply don't want to shop for deals or be bound by their limitations.

I figure the biggest profit increase will come in food and beverage as guests will feel they have more cash-on-hand since their skiing was paid for well in advance.

When Colorado areas first started doing cheap season passes about 10 years ago I read that about half of all the purchasers never used their pass. Also people noticed earlier closings. There was a point in the spring, beyond which almost all the skiers were season pass holders, and the mountain already had their money. Freakonomics, so to speak.

AHA - THAT may explain why Snowshoe has a history of closing abruptly before the posted Close date!!! And, doesn't this money up-front mean less income next year? Sorta front-loading the books for some(?) reason.

They got in 1000 cards on Sat afternoon and by Sunday they were GONE. My son got the last pass. My wife will have to wait.

I agree that the price of lodging will most likely go up next year. I was told that on several weekends this season (non holiday) the village properties were 90+% occupied.

Friday was fantastic and Saturday was the typical Ballhooter zoo.

We followed the well documented plan to hit Silver Creek Sat afternoon. I "may" have waited in line 2 minutes max on Sat at SC.

We did likewise, Don... We started off in Cupp/Shays and even that got crowded after 11 on Saturday, so we went to Silver Creek and literally skied into the lifts. And yes, the resort was over 90% booked. We had a problem with folks trying to poach on our condo parking...

Snowshoe, a great place to enjoy winter.
The Colonel

So how many of us jumped on the deal? I picked one up and will spend a couple of days there before heading over to Canaan Valley for the Luau.

This 199 pass has me thinking about Intrawest's business model.

What rough percentage of on-mountain lodging does Intrawest own? For real estate owned by others, are any annual or one-time fees charged by Intrawest? (If they operate/contract out booking services, I assume they also collect money there.)

Same question for food and beverage operations.

I assume Intrawest collects a fee from all private businesses located on-mountain (ski shops, gift shops, food/beverage stores, etc.), similar to what happens in a mall.

Any other major income streams they may have? (Outside of lift tickets.) Equipment rentals? Activities?

Seeing that the regular price for a unlimited season pass is only $300, they must be making more money off of lodging, food and activities. Even on condo's that are individually owned, they list and do reservations for them and I'm sure they take a good percentage off the top. Especially when you can find the essentially the same condo on VRBO for $25 - $50 dollars less a night.

A season pass there is usually $300?

They are only 249 + tax until the end of the month, then go up to 299 + after 3/31

Even if one missed the 199 deal, 249 or 299 is a helluva lot cheaper than most places.

1. none - all privately owned
2. Owners pay a Mountain Tax to Intrawest which is really their business expenses.
3. Intrawest takes something like 35% of your rental fee Plus a Cleaning fee, turnover fee, and Breakage Insurance fee. What's worse is any Stay 3rd Nite Free - who do you suppose is paying for that free night? And you have to agree for them to rent out your place free for a certain number of nights per season.
4. Intrawest owns most all businesses there and leases out space to a few that go OOB regularly. Name all the restaurants that were in the "current" Mexican place and old Hot Dog place.
5. Activities like the zip-line infrastructure were paid for by the zip-line company.
Their ultimate business model would be to mothball and open only 3 months-a-year.

3. Main reason why I never will rent my property with Intrawest. Plus our condos are relegated to rentals to unsupervised college students to whom I have no interest in renting my property. From a near million-dollar fire to tens of thousands in common property damage, our history with college students is horrible. You don't normally see college students in Allegheny Springs...

4. The contract with the few private businesses also stipulates they will open at certain times in the dead season, thereby ensuring income loss....

5. Summertime can be a busy time at Snowshoe with HOG rallies and mountain biking, but that carries its own hazards....

Thanks snow.buck.

WRT real estate, most likely Intrawest made a lot of money during the initial development lodging. Once an area is built-out, that cash flow stops.

My next door neighbor goes to some of those rallies.

I think all ski areas are trying to go to some type of four seasons model, if they can.

Point 3 makes a lot of sense and is what I'd do if I could afford it.

DITTO Lou's comments.

Unfortunately for me, they send A LOT of church groups and scout groups to Mountain Lodge with limited supervision.

Golden rule of renting vacation property ..... Adult Couples and Families. You can eliminate a lot of risk that way but not 100%

No dot edu's.
No church groups.
No scout groups (boy or girl).
No ski patrol.

Only flaw there is that SS will rent to anyone online w/VISA card: Charles Manson to a bunch of 16 year olds with Daddy's card, etc. That's why I leave mine sit empty til I can dump it vs. the damage from Renters. Summer events are less & less every year. Sometime Intrawest will wise up and shut the place down April-Nov.

Sorry - I should have added that

"since I rent my own place and I screen every guest as best I can."

About Scouts
This year I took 28 scouts, 2 sisters, and 21 adults to Snowshoe. We do not stay on-mountain since we can get a better deal off mountain. In my 10 years with the troop, we have not damaged any property and would discipline any scout who did.

About the pass
I was glad to buy two passes and we have already used them two days to ski nice shin-deep powder in the woods and ride a nice lift back up. I got a nice rental from VRBO. I bought groceries at Wildcat and some beer and pizza at Moonshine. I hope to get back up there this month as I am quite happy with the arrangement.

jeesh, lots of complaining on here. just give me more snow, beer and pizza ! I hope they can put all that pass money to some good use. I expect $3M is a pretty small amount compared to their operating budget.

...ah college in the 90's at D&E while working at snowshoe ski school...crashing parties and couch surfin' at the blowshoe on the weekends...those were the good ole days...sorry for any damage that might have occured---from what I remember I was respectful, but I did see some crazy S&*$ go down...one could literally go up there on the weekends without a place to stay on friday afternoon and have it made until sunday morning without a dime if you knew how to play your cards...couch surfin', ski bummin'...if things went bad just crash in the car with a sleepin' bag...ain't that right red?...

...no matter how far it goes, I don't see anyone turnin' away 3 mil...that's probably more revenue than some of the other WV resorts see all season...

Fo shizzle...if I didn't crash in the truck I can proudly say that in the past 25 years I have stayed at 20 different cribs from the bottom of Back Hollow Rd to Ben Bush to the original gas station in Canaan Heights and about every other place in between. Finally bit the bullet 3 years ago and scored a 100 year old house behind the fire dept in Davis. If I can't see across the river I know its puking...if I can't see the fire house its because I'm already on the hill!!!

Most of us were in College at one time or another... My point is that Snowshoe makes it a point to segregate college students in two or three condo complexes. The rest are free from them. Our condo complex, being one of the older properties and three-bedrooms, is a favorite for Snowshoe rental system to stuff college kids. Added to that is that Snowshoe management has made the unspeakably stupid decision not to deputize its security system. The result is, virtually, uncaged animals who are well aware nothing will happen to them if they literally burn down a building and can tell the resort security to pound sand (in more colorful language). I recently rode a lift (unknowingly) with the head of lodging and when asked, I told him that I'd rather spend a week in hell before renting my unit through the Snowshoe rental system. He was certainly put off and I told him most of my fellow owners would do the same thing.

A whole week? Yikes...

That's too funny Lou, but from what I've heard your first week in hell isn't so bad.

And so it begins, the season pass holders looking to capitalize on their 199 investment.

(XXXX's used to protect the innocent)

Here are a few lines from a vrbo inquiry I replied to this morning.

Subject: Inquiry from XXXXX XXXXXX - Dec 1 to Jan 26 - Listing #67887

Inquiry Detail
Hello, I'm interested in renting a Snowshoe condo for the entire snow season next year (~12/15/13 to 3/30/14). I am wondering if this is something you would consider, and if so, how much you would charge in total for the entire 3.5 (or 4) months. I look forward to your response.

Thanks, XXXXXX

LOL LOL Now THAT'S wishful thinking...I'd put a SS "season" as maybe some of Dec, closing anytime in March Intrawest feels business dropped ! If he'd let you charge him for 4(four) months you might think about it - one renter, less turnaround, slightly less damage!

Now you're getting some where. Tell him you'll take $8000, you could probably rent a place in Timberline for the season for around $5k and enjoy some peace.

Now there's a good idea. Make $3k AND get in on the BEST skiing in the region. It's a WIN/WIN!!

All jokes aside, can one really get a place all season for 5K at TL? Proximity to the slopes? Plumbing and electric?

Probably.
10 minutes.
Indoor.

In Tucker County?

ssshhh, keep quiet or everyone will want some.

Note to self. May be worth investigating for 2013 - 2014 season.

Definitely doable. Just not in Timberline, but less than 10 minutes to slopes.

For sure, we rented a 2 bed,2 bath +loft for $3300 within 100 yards of Timberline this winter. That was for 3 months. There aren't a lot of full season rentals available but you can find them if you try hard enough. Divide the rent among multiple people and it can become pretty reasonable, even for higher priced units.

$3,300? Damn that's a good price... That's the equivalent of two weekends at my place at Snowshoe....

Not WV, but a couple years ago I found a TH in Ogden (Snowbasin, Powder Mountain) that was willing to rent Nov-April for $4k. Alas, I had these things called a job and a family that prevented me from taking the plunge and moving out there for a winter.

Tucker, was this 15,000 figure generally reported, or do you have an inside scoop?

Just wonderin'

Woody

..no inside scoop...I was just going on what Madmonk posted in this thread...sounded like he got that info from the folks in the office makin' the passes...

When I picked up my pass a few weeks ago, I flat out asked the girl at the desk and she said 15K.

They STILL have a $199 deal but limited, which means not valid on holiday weekends, but frankly, I wouldn't recommend being anywhere near Snowshoe on holiday weekends.

I really love snowshoe... but NEVER again on any weekend or holiday season (even a free ticket wouldn't get me there)

Yep, just got the info from the folks in the Depot. I will say they did a fairly good job of using social media to market the passes.

Since I'm one of those 15,000 pass holders, I plan on using mine starting tomorrow and through this weekend.

Snowshoe report 4" last night and 1 - 3" more today.

I'll be at the Ballhooter rope drop every morning at 9 AM facing towards Spruce and Skip Jack.

Black helmet with my ever popular Steelers sticker on the back of it if anyone is in the neighborhood.

To hell with the groundhog. Still a few weeks of WINTER left so get out there!

Well sayed.

Except this year the sales and the weather were so good that they stayed open for an additional two weeks after their closing date.

Lodging? I'm getting rid of my renter at the Bonner Mountain Hotel and Four Season Resort. Rented it during season for $800/mo December 1 thru closing. I'm going to be selling it so I can buy new digs a little closer in that me and the Mrs. will retire in. It was about 8 miles out and 15 minutes, tops, on white roads.

Closing party?

Farewell reunion tour?

Best wishes with that. Sounds wunderbar.
Now that I have a kid at UVA I pass by Reva a lot going up and down 29 and think of you. Love the view of the mtns on that stretch of Rt 29, but the views around CV are even better.

Then you are one mile from my home. We turn right on rt 609 or Hoover Road as it more commonly known. About 45 minutes away from Barracks Road. The place here is beautiful, but as I "mature" I find the yard work and house upkeep on the 11 acres a bit of a chore.

Sure. Any reason for a party. Won't be for a month or so.

Sounds good!!!
These first real hot days must have you wanting to be in Canaan Valley. Wonder how warm it got there today?
The Colonel