5 snowboarders die Loveland Pass avalanche today
May 13, 2013
36 posts
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I have skied that area several times. As described, "Skiers and snowboarders in search of fresh snow often hitchhike from lower elevations to the rocky summit above tree line. ". There is a large turnout not far above the Loveland ski area where I have parked, then hitched a ride to the top, traversed out 100 yards or so and skied down. If you don't go out too far from the road everything funnels down into a small stream drainage that takes you back to your car. It is about 800 vertical feet and requires only solid blue skills with the exception of one tight choke point in the stream bed when you are almost down. It is easy to do 4 or 5 laps in an afternoon. I am quite sure that there is nothing over 30 degrees if you head down within 100 yards of the road and it should not slide in that zone. Thus I am skeptical about the accuracy of the NYT story, which is a verbatim copy of the initial report in a local CO paper and is therefore unworthy of the respect normally given the NYT.
If you traversed further out before heading down, it is a different story. About 1/4 mile out is "idiot's cornice". It often overhangs the then 40+ degree slope by 20 feet or more. I have skied the pass on 3 occasions, all in June when the spring corn cycle is well established and avy danger should be virtually non existent. Nevertheless I stay well away from that cornice, always starting down within 100 yards of the road.
I have skied the pass on 3 occasions, all in June when the spring corn cycle is well established and avy danger should be virtually non existent. Nevertheless I stay well away from that cornice, always starting down within 100 yards of the road.
I guess by 'virtually' you mean "with the exception of isothermal slides"?
Good point on the sourcing of the article, BTW.
I have skied the pass on 3 occasions, all in June when the spring corn cycle is well established and avy danger should be virtually non existent. Nevertheless I stay well away from that cornice, always starting down within 100 yards of the road.
I guess by 'virtually' you mean "with the exception of isothermal slides"?
No, that would be a slow wet slide. When I have skied it is when nights are below freezing and the entire snowpack is solid boilerplate when the sun comes up. Then the top 1/2 inch to say 2" tuns to smooth skiable corn over a firm base. That entails some melting so water seeps down into the deeper snowpack and again freezes overnight. I've never skied anywhere where the entire snowpack turns to wet slush and would never do so in backcountry.
Ah, 'k. I guess I was thrown by the 'June' bit as I have skied this
No, that would be a slow wet slide. When I have skied it is when nights are below freezing and the entire snowpack is solid boilerplate when the sun comes up. Then the top 1/2 inch to say 2" tuns to smooth skiable corn over a firm base. That entails some melting so water seeps down into the deeper snowpack and again freezes overnight.
in late April even.
I posted my first comment on the SkiVT List. Two friends there have also skied it. One lived in the area for 5 years, did a lot of backcountry and had his pass at Loveland which he considers the best area in CO because of its vast, high, easily accessed side and back country. He believes these victims were in a different spot than where djop and I have skied, which is quite safe. He believes that they left the road shortly above the hairpin turn on the Denver side of Rt 6. (We skied on the Summit County side). The hairpin is about halfway to the top of the pass. It is indeed steep there. My friend skied it many times and said that after the steep initial drop it passes through a narrow crux between high rock walls that make a perfect terrain trap. It probably ends at the Loveland Valley slopes, the beginner area of Loveland.
At least one victim had all the right experience training and certifications. Food for thought.
I still have the heebie jeebies from the combination of the terrain pic and the Wildsnow mention of tree debris.
One of the recovered still had skins on and another was buried 18'. This happened after they attending an avy review seminar the previous evening.
A few weeks ago a UDOT avy forecaster perished in a solo slide.
Does not matter how well you are edumacated, u can still git bit off.
Live2ski,ski2live.
The avalanche was quite large and engulfed the entire group from above at approximately 10:15am. The avalanche pushed all group members between 5 and 20 feet into the Sheep Creek gully. Five of the six members of the group were completely buried. The survivor was 3rd in line at the time of the accident, and was partially buried in very close proximity (touching) to the two group members in the front of the line. The survivor came to rest in an upright semi-seated position with his lower left arm free, and his face very near the surface. He was able to clear the snow from his face, and at that point could breath freely. He then began slowly moving snow away from his face and head and trying to free his right arm from the snow. The survivor continued to yell for help, but to no avail, as there was no one left unburied to hear him and no other people in the area. The survivor was stranded in this position for approximately 4 hours before rescuers arrived at the scene
These guys were super expert backcountry people with tons of knowledge and all the best equipment, but none of that is much help when the avi debris buries you in the blink of an eye and immediately sets-up like quick drying concrete.
I don't really have big backcountry ambitions, but this could happen inbounds too and makes you really respect the patrollers who do safety work to protect us resort skiers/boarders.
The avalanche was quite large and engulfed the entire group from above at approximately 10:15am. The avalanche pushed all group members between 5 and 20 feet into the Sheep Creek gully. Five of the six members of the group were completely buried. The survivor was 3rd in line at the time of the accident, and was partially buried in very close proximity (touching) to the two group members in the front of the line. The survivor came to rest in an upright semi-seated position with his lower left arm free, and his face very near the surface. He was able to clear the snow from his face, and at that point could breath freely. He then began slowly moving snow away from his face and head and trying to free his right arm from the snow. The survivor continued to yell for help, but to no avail, as there was no one left unburied to hear him and no other people in the area. The survivor was stranded in this position for approximately 4 hours before rescuers arrived at the scene
Gives me chills...
Not sure how well friends and family of the deceased will take this Lou Dawson post. He basically exhaustively documents in words and pictures why he thinks they [censored] up royally, which cost them their lives.
Not sure how well friends and family of the deceased will take this Lou Dawson post. He basically exhaustively documents in words and pictures why he thinks they [censored] up royally, which cost them their lives.
I thought he did a good job. It's going to be a long time before family and friends can discuss it dispassionately; in the meantime Lou feels that the rest of us need to know and learn from this. He knows he has the pulpit and the respect of the backcountry community and he feels a responsibility.
Maybe Dawson can revisit this matter if/when he gets a chance to talk to the survivor. The survivor's input could paint a different picture or corroborate the misjudgement. If anyone sees an interview/quotes from the survivor hope you'll post here.
He knows he has the pulpit and the respect of the backcountry community and he feels a responsibility.
I realize you are a big fan (and I find his site useful), but he is not universally loved. From what I saw from this past incident, I'm starting to understand some of the criticisms. He doth love the soapbox a bit too much.
John,
Point noted. A lecture from Bruce Tremper is easier to take than a lecture from Lou. BTW, all of us who do adventure skiing in the west (in bounds or out) need to have and read Tremper's book, "Staying Alive in Avalanche Terrain." There! I'll get off my soapbox now.
I realize you are a big fan (and I find his site useful), but he is not universally loved. From what I saw from this past incident, I'm starting to understand some of the criticisms. He doth love the soapbox a bit too much.
I thought he managed to bury the 'you should be aware of slope orientation as mapped into daily risk factors' point a little too deep in that article. imho and ymmv of course.
I realize you are a big fan (and I find his site useful), but he is not universally loved. From what I saw from this past incident, I'm starting to understand some of the criticisms. He doth love the soapbox a bit too much.
I thought he managed to bury the 'you should be aware of slope orientation as mapped into daily risk factors' point a little too deep in that article. imho and ymmv of course.
Bury is a poorly-chosen verb.
That said, there was nothing subtle about LD's article. To repeat meself some more, excessive documentation of his point. IMHO, his point is very well taken, but excessively presented. Especially considering the circumstances. And I ain't a PC, touchy-feely guy.
One more thing.
Everything I've read about the folks who lost their lives in this Avi incident was incredibly positive about their lives. For some of them, I wish I had lived my life like theirs, up until that fateful day. And hence, the fateful crux. We need to learn from their mistakes, but we need to be very, very, very respectful of what they accomplished. They shared the same dreams as most of us have.
And I ain't a PC, touchy-feely guy.
I can verify that...think "Stump" Farm comment...
Maybe Dawson can revisit this matter if/when he gets a chance to talk to the survivor. The survivor's input could paint a different picture or corroborate the misjudgement. If anyone sees an interview/quotes from the survivor hope you'll post here.
There is a radio interview with the Director of CAIC done by NPR. He talks about the fact that being able to learn facts from the survivor had an impact on the level of detail possible in the final report.
http://kunc.org/post/caic-says-deadly-avalanche-could-have-been-preventedSeveral media reports I've seen mention that the survivor is declining interviews. He is a family man getting good support from family and friends, including his boss. Must be really tough.
Bury is a poorly-chosen verb.
Not if by "poorly" you mean 'without thought'. It was a deliberately crafted allusion.
And I ain't a PC, touchy-feely guy.
and, back to my point about the article, you really got an explicit message of "NE exposures would have been
especially wind loaded
on that particular day and the group should have been aware of the compass orientation of the slope they were traversing under"? Without looking for it?
Just now reading through all of the details. Particularly interesting to me since I was out there a month ago and took a picture at the top of Loveland Pass.
Does the CAIC think the group of people actually triggered the avalanche that started so far above them? Or did they just happen to be in the wrong spot at the wrong time and the avalanche was triggered naturally?
I think their opinion is that it was triggered from below, like pulling a log off the bottom of the woodpile.
A quote from one of the wise old heads on Telemarktips.com (there are a few).
"Whether a commercial airliner crash, or fender bender in a parking
lot, or a war gone bad, all "accidents" are a harrowing sequence
of events that in hindsight could have been averted."
If so, why do the experts keep dying in avalanches?
(Quote got garbled by the embedded link.)
There is always a non zero risk in avalanche terrain each time it is entered. Spend enough time in such terrain, over a lifetime and the risk of being caught one time goes up. One time is all it takes. It has been true for as long as I've followed this stuff that, statistically, the best way to die in an avalanche is to be an avalanche expert. Think of playing Russian Roulette over and over again.
