Folks - it is looking bleak for an extended local ski season. I can't image the former Snowtime resorts will last much longer. The southern resorts in VA can't be doing too well. The Laurels resorts, 7S, HV and LM have a surface that does not ski well and there is a very limited window to make snow for the upcoming Presidents Day weekend. After that, the weather looks bleak. The only MA resorts hanging on to some descent terrain are the higher elevation resorts - Snowshoe and Timberline. That said I am guessing that the snow surface is deteriorating quicky into April like conditions.
In my 48 years of skiing at our little mole hills, I cannot remember a worse ski season. The current La Nina weather pattern which we've had for the last 3 years is supposed to be ending. Will that bring us better weather for the 2023/2024 ski season? Or is this becoming a permanent weather pattern signaling, perhaps, and end to MA skiing. I sure hope not.
I am currently trying to schedule a trip to Utah or Colorado so I can ski on real snow.
This situation is depressing. JimK has the right idea.
No the pattern is changing back to El Nino so I'm hoping to see a rebound again in March. Artic Air will be pushing south.
Yes 2018 March weekend trip turned into a week trip. Truck broke down so I had to get a rental from Staunton (last 4wd they had) to get to Snowshoe. Stayed in a least 4 different places that week. One of the best if not the best time of east coast riding.
Meanwhile it's 22 degrees at Cataloochee in NC as of 6pm on Feb. 17 and snowmaking is going full blast.
Snowmaking in progress at Massanutten, Timberline, and Canaan Valley too.
Going to look different by morning in a number of places.
Somebody say what's up at liberty whitetop please. Hope as manynof yall as possible y'all are shredding it somewhere.
marzNC wrote:
Meanwhile it's 22 degrees at Cataloochee in NC as of 6pm on Feb. 17 and snowmaking is going full blast.
Snowmaking in progress at Massanutten, Timberline, and Canaan Valley too.
Going to look different by morning in a number of places.
Snowshoe received 3" natural and lots of machine made. This brings the total season to a whopping 34.5" which is roughly 30"+ more than all resorts east of Snowshoe! Conditions here on Saturday were exceptional and really good through mid day Sunday.
7Springs had some bare spots this weekend. Sunday was mashed potatoes on top of some really hard stuff that would catch you off guard easily. Lots of muddy/wet butts this weekend. The resort was PACKED, but the lift lines were long for periods of time but not as bad as previous. By 3p on Sunday, it was pretty dead. By 5pm we didnt wait for more than a minute to get on the lift. Everyone must have gone inside.
I fear for 7S. They made enough snow when needed but I think they were banking on some natural, and that didnt materialize but what did was very warm temps/rain, with little opportunity to make snow...
and here we are again. 2 week forecast shows MAYBE two nights that they can make snow with many days being quite warm w/ rain. That's a bad combination for what they have already which is barely holding onto a few inches of base in MANY areas.
Im hoping they are wrong about the forecast....but they are always wrong when it comes to snow and snow totals, never the bad news.
If I can get the kids out 3 more times I wont feel like I lost out on passes this year.
The season is what you make of it honestly, and agreeing it has definitely been poor conditions, but I've still been having a blast going around and skiing the Mid-Atlantic. I suppose that's what a significant hiatus away from the sport will do to someone haha. Enjoy the video from Mnut! footage from 2/21
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrgOWB3s21g
snapdragon wrote:
the mass should have cut their tix in half for the hard cores i see on the cams...i bet the plug gets pulled tomorrow looking at next week's forecast
Massanutten has Snow Moon Fest scheduled for March 3-5. One way or another, there will be a few slopes open next weekend.
The width and depth of the snow on Southern Comfort is more than in the past decade after similar heat waves. Same for Diamond Jim and Showtime. The old stick guns on Upper Showtime were replaced with TT10 fan guns. Can't tell that from the webcams.
When was the last time you skied at Massanutten?
Massanutten fan guns on Showtime, mid-January 2023
Conditions over at Whitetail on closing weekend, their shortest season ever apparently. Made the most of it, enjoy!
Massanutten decided today to suspend operations Wed-Fri in order to have slopes open March 4-5. They have hopes for another chance for snowmaking by the end of the week.
Hey why didn't you drive to 7S? Also wanna say I'm a huge fan of your how to survive fed prison YouTube vids. Keep up the good work. I'm rooting for you.
ShredDMV wrote:
Conditions over at Whitetail on closing weekend, their shortest season ever apparently. Made the most of it, enjoy!
There was SOME excitement a few days ago that the laurels would get a decent snowfall.
Well that's been cancelled. Instead we will get rain again.
I feel like a lactose intolerant person who works for a cheesecake factory.
Wow I just looked at their webcam. How do they think they are going to reopen this weekend?
snapdragon wrote:
it doesn't matter when the last time i was at the mass...i can look at a web cam...read a trail report...analyze a 10 day weather forecast...arrive at the conclusion that muddy corn on 3 trails isn't worth $90...no matter how much lipstick is on the pig
bob wrote:
Conditions in the mid Atlantic might look grim, but the Poconos are looking alright. Actually, Blue, Montage and Elk look pretty good
I skied Jack Frost (AM) and Big Boulder (PM) this Monday (prior to the 7 inches on Monday night). The conditions were pretty solid and not a soul around. It was nice to try somewhere new and my 6 year old enjoyed the "trails in the trees" at Jack Frost.
Seven Springs posted this picture this morning at about 7:15.
This is from Seven Springs 2 days ago. "And we do see opportunities for snowmaking the second half of the weekend – and beyond – which we fully intend to take advantage of once the temps drop!"
Well, here we are again.
I remember this post, and I was hopeful that Feb would do what Feb normally does in the Laurels - and just snow snow snow. And here we are almost exactly a year later and this post fits exactly to that of last year. Almost like the movie groundhog day, and today is groundhog day.
Ugh.
Welp, get out there while you can. Weather will be 60 next week from now. Sigh.
snowsmith wrote:
Folks - it is looking bleak for an extended local ski season. I can't image the former Snowtime resorts will last much longer. The southern resorts in VA can't be doing too well. The Laurels resorts, 7S, HV and LM have a surface that does not ski well and there is a very limited window to make snow for the upcoming Presidents Day weekend. After that, the weather looks bleak. The only MA resorts hanging on to some descent terrain are the higher elevation resorts - Snowshoe and Timberline. That said I am guessing that the snow surface is deteriorating quicky into April like conditions.
In my 48 years of skiing at our little mole hills, I cannot remember a worse ski season. The current La Nina weather pattern which we've had for the last 3 years is supposed to be ending. Will that bring us better weather for the 2023/2024 ski season? Or is this becoming a permanent weather pattern signaling, perhaps, and end to MA skiing. I sure hope not.
I am currently trying to schedule a trip to Utah or Colorado so I can ski on real snow.
This situation is depressing. JimK has the right idea.
Grump - I agree in the short term it does not look good. But just about every weather model agrees that a return of an extended cold period will start mid-month. The "Euro" model below illustrates this expected change in the pattern.
Grumpy dad wrote:
Well, here we are again.
I remember this post, and I was hopeful that Feb would do what Feb normally does in the Laurels - and just snow snow snow. And here we are almost exactly a year later and this post fits exactly to that of last year. Almost like the movie groundhog day, and today is groundhog day.
Ugh.
Welp, get out there while you can. Weather will be 60 next week from now. Sigh.
snowsmith wrote:
Folks - it is looking bleak for an extended local ski season. I can't image the former Snowtime resorts will last much longer. The southern resorts in VA can't be doing too well. The Laurels resorts, 7S, HV and LM have a surface that does not ski well and there is a very limited window to make snow for the upcoming Presidents Day weekend. After that, the weather looks bleak. The only MA resorts hanging on to some descent terrain are the higher elevation resorts - Snowshoe and Timberline. That said I am guessing that the snow surface is deteriorating quicky into April like conditions.
In my 48 years of skiing at our little mole hills, I cannot remember a worse ski season. The current La Nina weather pattern which we've had for the last 3 years is supposed to be ending. Will that bring us better weather for the 2023/2024 ski season? Or is this becoming a permanent weather pattern signaling, perhaps, and end to MA skiing. I sure hope not.
I am currently trying to schedule a trip to Utah or Colorado so I can ski on real snow.
This situation is depressing. JimK has the right idea.
I hope you're right snowsmith. But at what point do resorts just give up? By late next week the entire base will most likely be at risk even in resorts with better snowmaking.
snowsmith wrote:
Grump - I agree in the short term it does not look good. But just about every weather model agrees that a return of an extended cold period will start mid-month. The "Euro" model below illustrates this expected change in the pattern.
Grumpy dad wrote:
Well, here we are again.
I remember this post, and I was hopeful that Feb would do what Feb normally does in the Laurels - and just snow snow snow. And here we are almost exactly a year later and this post fits exactly to that of last year. Almost like the movie groundhog day, and today is groundhog day.
Ugh.
Welp, get out there while you can. Weather will be 60 next week from now. Sigh.
snowsmith wrote:
Folks - it is looking bleak for an extended local ski season. I can't image the former Snowtime resorts will last much longer. The southern resorts in VA can't be doing too well. The Laurels resorts, 7S, HV and LM have a surface that does not ski well and there is a very limited window to make snow for the upcoming Presidents Day weekend. After that, the weather looks bleak. The only MA resorts hanging on to some descent terrain are the higher elevation resorts - Snowshoe and Timberline. That said I am guessing that the snow surface is deteriorating quicky into April like conditions.
In my 48 years of skiing at our little mole hills, I cannot remember a worse ski season. The current La Nina weather pattern which we've had for the last 3 years is supposed to be ending. Will that bring us better weather for the 2023/2024 ski season? Or is this becoming a permanent weather pattern signaling, perhaps, and end to MA skiing. I sure hope not.
I am currently trying to schedule a trip to Utah or Colorado so I can ski on real snow.
This situation is depressing. JimK has the right idea.
It will get cold enough mid-month for everyone to make snow and freshen up their existing trails.
I wonder about places like Wintergreen. Their conditions are abysmal right now, and the mountain is only about half open. Will they make an effort to open the rest of the mountain so late in the season? If not, then this will be the second year in the row they barely get half open.
HVdad wrote:
I think it’s done for the lower elevation resorts and a few resorts in the south. Liberty, Roundtop, Whitetail, M’Nutt, Wintergreen all in big trouble, they’ve normalized skiing in crud. Go north or go up in elevation.
Have you skied Massanutten in the last year or two? The depth on the core trails is well over 3 feet and the number of trails with contours that are essentially stored snow is impressive. I skied Mnut last week for two days and had a good time. Didn't rain at all on Thursday. By Friday evening, the trails had been packed down by skiers/boarders after the snow softened mid-afternoon. The investment in increasing water supply, automated snowguns, big fan guns (replacing old stick guns), took about a decade but is clearly paying off. The key is being able to make snow 3+ days in a row when daytime temps remain low. Mnut can now have 200+ snowguns firing at the same time for hours and hours without running out of water.
The folks skiing in NC are having a good time this season. Those resorts have continually added snowmaking infrastructure. That's how to stay in ski business in the southeast for 50+ years. Also helps to generate revenue in the summer time.
Keith_Moon wrote:
The NC and WV resorts all seem to be doing fine, as does Wisp. I think the ones that are having trouble are just in PA and VA.
Massanutten is doing just fine. They made snow early this morning, Feb. 3. From what I can tell, there will be snowmaking opportunities most nights in the next week. Mnut is 100% open and has been most days since Jan. 17. Keep in mind that includes new trails on the upper mountain that didn't exist a few years ago that added around 100 snowguns. There are 55 on Mueller's Mile. I've been skiing Mnut since 2005 and the difference is impressive.
The amount of investment in snowmaking infrastructure in the last decade at Mnut is amazing. Especially for a resort that is employee owned via an ESOP, which was started in 1995 and gained 100% ownership in 2015. The key is that Mnut was a 4-season resort from the beginning in the 1970s. The revenue from golf courses and the waterpark helped provide the financial resources to update and upgrade the slopes starting around 2006. The revenue from snowsports means the winter season is also bringing in revenue. That means many more people can have year-round jobs. I recognize lifties who have been doing the job for a decade at least . . . who don't ski/board.
Bryce is doing fine as well, from what I can tell. It's the oldest ski resort in VA. Like Appalachian in NC, Bryce is small but is in a cold pocket that makes snowmaking possible more often than not, and understands the market very well.
Both Mnut and Bryce were early adopters of the Indy Pass.
Wintergreen is another story completely. W'green was ahead of Mnut for high-speed lifts and snowmaking for a while. But not being able to get Highlands and Acorn 100% open has hurt in recent years. There hasn't been much news about snowmaking infrastructure upgrades for a while. Like Snowshoe, W'green is an upside-down resort that's not particularly close to a population center. Staffing is probably harder for W'green than Mnut. From a customer standpoint, there isn't much to do for someone who books lodging for a long weekend in advance at W'green and happens to have bad luck with snow and/or weather conditions.
Yes, they are perennially disappointing. Maybe they get enough warm-weather revenue that they can keep afloat just by half-assing it in the winter. If they would do what M'nut does they could be awesome.
marzNC wrote:
Wintergreen is another story completely.
Keith_Moon wrote:
Yes, they are perennially disappointing. Maybe they get enough warm-weather revenue that they can keep afloat just by half-assing it in the winter. If they would do what M'nut does they could be awesome.
marzNC wrote:
Wintergreen is another story completely.
Like Timberline, it's not about the terrain or the location . . . it's about the owner's commitment to what it takes to continually improve the infrastructure related to snowsports for the long run. Meaning snowmaking and lifts. Sooner or later lifts need an update or upgrade plan.
Massanutten has managers for snowsports who have worked there for decades. It makes a difference.
I've been paying attention to small hills in the midwest lately. Skied in Michigan last month. Saw first hand how Boyne Resorts is working to move Boyne Mountain and Highlands to the next level. That's where Everett Kircher started back in the 1950s. There are still old, slow lifts even as they put in fancy new D-line 6-pack/8-pack lifts for busy periods. Kircher had to invent snowmaking machinery. Across the valley from Highlands, Nub's Nob has staff who build and maintain snowguns and lifts year round. Their snowmaking is legendary even for that region. The place was hopping on a Thursday afternoon/evening with all the families coming on for race programs and multi-week lesson programs under the lights. It was easy to understand why the 70 Plus Ski Club has a popular annual 3-day gathering at Nub's every January. I was glad I opted to go when they were there.
Wintergreen is like some of the PA resorts. They were ahead of the game for a while and stopped innovating and keeping up with new technology.
Blue Mountain and Camelback are examples of PA resorts that have been upgrading/updating in recent years. Probably why they make sense as Ikon locations as of 2023-24. Camelback has an indoor waterpark. Blue is harder to reach, but clearly has a strong following from what I hear about crowds on weekends.
Good discussion. I agree with much of what MarzNC said.
Having skied regularly in the mid-A since 1967 it's been interesting to watch the ebb and flow of which resorts do well and don't do well.
Here's an article from 2000 where I reminisce about skiing back then. Here's an excerpt, which since it's from 2000 I'd need to update to reflect current state of play:
[The hot spots I frequented for local skiing then were Charnita (now Liberty), Roundtop, and Bryce Mountain. Though still a fine children’s and beginner’s area, Bryce has been somewhat eclipsed by newer resorts in recent years. Liberty and Roundtop remain key venues for the local D.C. skier/boarder action, with Whitetail joining the mix in the past decade.
An hour or two further away, other popular old areas like Seven Springs, Canaan Valley, Wisp, Blue Knob, and Camelback offer additional options for Beatles-era skiers. Most of these resorts were every bit as crowded on prime winter weekends as they are now. In fact, perhaps more so, because many of the additional local areas we now have access to, such as Massanutten, Wintergreen, Whitetail, Winterplace, Snowshoe, Timberline, and Hidden Valley, didn’t come along and absorb a lot of the skier traffic until years later.
It’s well known that the number of active skiers nationwide has been fairly constant over the last 10 years. I’m sure that if someone could quantify it, we would all be pleased to know that there are now many more miles of available ski runs per number of participants than 30 years ago. I can remember back in the 1970’s when the lines for the two main double chairs at the bottom of Mambo Alley at Blue Knob, Pennsylvania would each stretch endlessly on many Saturday and Sunday afternoons. It took about an hour or more to muddle through them.
As America’s ski industry has downsized or consolidated in recent years, we’ve had a few local casualties too. In the 1970’s I once visited a short lived northern Virginia ski area called something like “Seven Devils” near Shenandoah National Park. For quite a few years there was a small, now defunct, Maryland area called Braddock Heights. It operated near I-70, close to where Whitetail is now.
You might have been one of the few to try Cherokee ski area west of Warrenton, Virginia during the few brief seasons it operated around a decade ago. It became a victim of inadequate cash flow and a succession of warm greenhouse-effect winters. You can still see Cherokee’s trail cuts off to the left as you head west on I-66 near Linden, VA.]
Thanks for the link. That's from before I was active on DCSki.
I noted what JimK wrote about Massanutten in 2000:
"I have skied at the Massanutten ski area, a few hours south of D.C. near Harrisonburg, VA, several times a winter for the last 15 years. During the vast majority of those visits they had no natural snow on the ground. Additionally, the daytime tempratures were often above 50 degrees, yet they routinely had 90-100% of their terrain open every January and February. It’s like that all around the region now and it has greatly improved the typical ski experience and cut down on the ice/rock/dirt factor that was much more prevalent in the ‘60’s and ‘70’s."
When I was taking my daughter to ski at Mnut the week before Christmas in 2006-12, there was only one time there wasn't enough snow for any slopes to be open. The 2012-13 season was also when an early March snowstorm meant there was enough snow to go sledding on the golf course and make snowmen the weekend of March 9-10. A father and daughter made the drive from Pittsburgh that weekend. They and my daughter (girls were tweens) enjoyed the waterpark on Saturday evening.
These days, Massanutten has a Snow Moon Fest the first weekend of March. Any ski days after that will be gravy but is likely to happen.
JimK wrote:
Good discussion. I agree with much of what MarzNC said.
Having skied regularly in the mid-A since 1967 it's been interesting to watch the ebb and flow of which resorts do well and don't do well.
Here's an article from 2000 where I reminisce about skiing back then. Here's an excerpt, which since it's from 2000 I'd need to update to reflect current state of play:
[The hot spots I frequented for local skiing then were Charnita (now Liberty), Roundtop, and Bryce Mountain. Though still a fine children’s and beginner’s area, Bryce has been somewhat eclipsed by newer resorts in recent years. Liberty and Roundtop remain key venues for the local D.C. skier/boarder action, with Whitetail joining the mix in the past decade.
An hour or two further away, other popular old areas like Seven Springs, Canaan Valley, Wisp, Blue Knob, and Camelback offer additional options for Beatles-era skiers. Most of these resorts were every bit as crowded on prime winter weekends as they are now. In fact, perhaps more so, because many of the additional local areas we now have access to, such as Massanutten, Wintergreen, Whitetail, Winterplace, Snowshoe, Timberline, and Hidden Valley, didn’t come along and absorb a lot of the skier traffic until years later.
It’s well known that the number of active skiers nationwide has been fairly constant over the last 10 years. I’m sure that if someone could quantify it, we would all be pleased to know that there are now many more miles of available ski runs per number of participants than 30 years ago. I can remember back in the 1970’s when the lines for the two main double chairs at the bottom of Mambo Alley at Blue Knob, Pennsylvania would each stretch endlessly on many Saturday and Sunday afternoons. It took about an hour or more to muddle through them.
As America’s ski industry has downsized or consolidated in recent years, we’ve had a few local casualties too. In the 1970’s I once visited a short lived northern Virginia ski area called something like “Seven Devils” near Shenandoah National Park. For quite a few years there was a small, now defunct, Maryland area called Braddock Heights. It operated near I-70, close to where Whitetail is now.
You might have been one of the few to try Cherokee ski area west of Warrenton, Virginia during the few brief seasons it operated around a decade ago. It became a victim of inadequate cash flow and a succession of warm greenhouse-effect winters. You can still see Cherokee’s trail cuts off to the left as you head west on I-66 near Linden, VA.]
snowsmith wrote:
Marz- I previously had a low opinion of the resorts south of DC. Especially , M’nut, as resort people used to call , Massofnothing. But they have really stepped up their game. I have yet to ski at M’nut. It’s a bit far from Baltimore. As far as NC resorts, they are small but I am amazed they can keep snow on those mountains. I think PA resorts west of the Alleghany front who depended on some natural snow will unfortunately need to make significant investments in snow making, like M’nut, to keep up with the competition. With climate change, I think their snow making systems need to be more like Roundtops or M’nut’s to account for the weather challenges.
From Baltimore, hard to say if a trek to Timberline versus Massanutten is more worth while at this point for someone who likes to ski bumps. If there is enough snow to ski trees in WV, then Timberline is better. The primary advantage for Mnut is not having to drive on WV roads, although US48 being 4-lane most of the makes a huge difference. I've been heading to Timberline for a night or two during my early January week at Mnut the last couple winters. Might do a day trip over Pres. Day weekend with the teen joining me. She hasn't skied anywhere but Mnut so far.
From the first time I skied Mnut in 2004, I enjoyed the fact that Lift 6 to the top at Mnut never had a lift line, even on holiday weekends. Now there is usually a line of 5+ chairs on weekends but it moves quickly with the detachable quad.
The layout for the expansion of the upper mountain trails at Mnut are pretty close to a plan made back in the 1970s. It took a long time to put enough water and snowmaking power in place to be able to cover more terrain up there. Even getting Paradice started wasn't happening before MLK weekend because of lack of pump capacity. The golf courses and waterpark came first from a business standpoint. Mnut is booked solid during the summer. In the winters, I can get a timeshare unit essentially any time without having to plan months in advance.
From my perspective, it's not the lifts that are the problem at WG; it's the snowmaking.
Their main lift is a really nice high speed 6-pack and I don't remember any issues with any of the other ones. Sure, some are slow but that's not uncommon. Although it can get brutally crowded there on weekends I don't blame the lifts for that.
In the 10 years I've been going there they just haven't demonstrated a commitment to consistently keeping their runs open.
I believe they consider themselves a 4-seasons resort more than a ski resort, whereas T-Line focuses on skiing (and frankly has a lot better weather). Obviously MNut also has a LOT going on beyond just skiing so it's really a credit to them that they have opened up new runs and generally improved their skiing experience. Maybe the collective ownership structure at MNut has facilitated that, inasmuch as since they are employee-owned they don't have to focus so much on quarterly profits, while WG's parent company, Pacific Group Resorts, is publicly traded.
marzNC wrote:
Keith_Moon wrote:
Yes, they are perennially disappointing. Maybe they get enough warm-weather revenue that they can keep afloat just by half-assing it in the winter. If they would do what M'nut does they could be awesome.
marzNC wrote:
Wintergreen is another story completely.
Like Timberline, it's not about the terrain or the location . . . it's about the owner's commitment to what it takes to continually improve the infrastructure related to snowsports for the long run. Meaning snowmaking and lifts. Sooner or later lifts need an update or upgrade plan.
Timberline was 100% open yesterday and every run was SWEET!! Not even really crowded as far as lift line wait.
I see no reason why they wont be 100% open all week with prime conditions before it gets colder second half of the month also!
Haven't been to the shoe, but hopefully they are 100% also given their prime locale.
Thus the problem - small crowds = less operating income. It's not the conditions, it is the economics. If they aren't making money they will close down. Seen it a thousand times. If ops is costing them they'll close down due to skier visits. Just like Zuckerberg/Metaverse.
Quote Siouxsie and the Banshees "Kiss them for me"
chaga wrote: "... Not even really crowded as far as lift line wait."
From my experience, TLine is able to manage the lift lines so it doesn't SEEM crowded.
I don't think their business is hurting.
Crush wrote:
Thus the problem - small crowds = less operating income. It's not the conditions, it is the economics. If they aren't making money they will close down. Seen it a thousand times. If ops is costing them they'll close down due to skier visits. Just like Zuckerberg/Metaverse.
Quote Siouxsie and the Banshees "Kiss them for me"
chaga wrote: "... Not even really crowded as far as lift line wait."
they do a great job managing the lines, and its a high speed 6pack. expanded parking lots and shuttle service this year. They are serving way more skiers than timberline ever did in the past, trust me. Their parent resort, Perfect North in Indiana right near Cincinnati, gets 5x the skiers as Timberline and is almost 100% open also, so tells you something about what a committed owner can do. They are focused and run a tight ship and Timberline is gonna improve snowmaking even MORE this summer! :)
Keith_Moon wrote:
From my experience, TLine is able to manage the lift lines so it doesn't SEEM crowded.
I don't think their business is hurting.
Crush wrote:
Thus the problem - small crowds = less operating income. It's not the conditions, it is the economics. If they aren't making money they will close down. Seen it a thousand times. If ops is costing them they'll close down due to skier visits. Just like Zuckerberg/Metaverse.
Quote Siouxsie and the Banshees "Kiss them for me"
chaga wrote: "... Not even really crowded as far as lift line wait."
It sure would be nice if they left one run with bumps or even skiers right of white lightning. The place was flat as a pancake this weekend and boring.
chaga wrote:
they do a great job managing the lines, and its a high speed 6pack. expanded parking lots and shuttle service this year. They are serving way more skiers than timberline ever did in the past, trust me. Their parent resort, Perfect North in Indiana right near Cincinnati, gets 5x the skiers as Timberline and is almost 100% open also, so tells you something about what a committed owner can do. They are focused and run a tight ship and Timberline is gonna improve snowmaking even MORE this summer! :)
Keith_Moon wrote:
From my experience, TLine is able to manage the lift lines so it doesn't SEEM crowded.
I don't think their business is hurting.
Crush wrote:
Thus the problem - small crowds = less operating income. It's not the conditions, it is the economics. If they aren't making money they will close down. Seen it a thousand times. If ops is costing them they'll close down due to skier visits. Just like Zuckerberg/Metaverse.
Quote Siouxsie and the Banshees "Kiss them for me"
chaga wrote: "... Not even really crowded as far as lift line wait."
Ooooh my Hart F17s would have a ski-gasim !
teleman wrote:
It sure would be nice if they left one run with bumps or even skiers right of white lightning. The place was flat as a pancake this weekend and boring.
I was at Whitetail this Sunday at 9am (27 degrees out). Skied 10 runs and left at 10:30. It was a sloppy mess with lots of brown showing. The snow just had a ton of moisture in it. Yes, all the rest of the slopes are open but I imagine they are quickly thinning out.
I skied TLine yesterday and it was amazing (started at 11:30 and skied until 4:30)! We got in 29 runs and the snow conditions were pure magic. Wall to wall coverage of great snow.
Heading out to Whitetail on Friday night to do some night skiing with my 7 year old and then heading to Wisp for the weekend. I know conditions will not be TLine but a day (or night on the slopes) are worth it. Especially with our short season.
Crush wrote:
Ooooh my Hart F17s would have a ski-gasim !
teleman wrote:
It sure would be nice if they left one run with bumps or even skiers right of white lightning. The place was flat as a pancake this weekend and boring.
If it's bumps you seek, Liberty has been the best place locally for years, as we basically hand build them to exact specs that we learned skiing with the World Cup athletes on the Blackcomb Glacier. Years ago, RT was the spot, but they fired their head groomer who used to make all the good bumps. WT was always hit or miss if the bumps on Exhibition would be good.
I've had a couple of pairs of the F17 Classic and it is a great ski when tuned properly. I know a lot of people that bought them back when they were still being made and had them mounted and then went skiing... big mistake. And of course they immediately hated the ski and a lot of people sold them without ever knowing that they did not come tuned from the factory. 2 degree base bevel and 1 degree side is what I skied mine at and they turned like butter.
Interesting to hear that about Liberty. I agree, they do have the best, most consistent bumps around. I wish more resorts would allow bumps to form on lower-angle trails so people can practice without going straight to the toughest trails on the mountain.
teleman wrote:
It sure would be nice if they left one run with bumps or even skiers right of white lightning. The place was flat as a pancake this weekend and boring.
If it's bumps you seek, Liberty has been the best place locally for years, as we basically hand build them to exact specs that we learned skiing with the World Cup athletes on the Blackcomb Glacier. Years ago, RT was the spot, but they fired their head groomer who used to make all the good bumps. WT was always hit or miss if the bumps on Exhibition would be good.
I've had a couple of pairs of the F17 Classic and it is a great ski when tuned properly. I know a lot of people that bought them back when they were still being made and had them mounted and then went skiing... big mistake. And of course they immediately hated the ski and a lot of people sold them without ever knowing that they did not come tuned from the factory. 2 degree base bevel and 1 degree side is what I skied mine at and they turned like butter.
Liberty always had bumps even 30+ years ago! Awesome place. good to hear its still got some character. :) Made a quick day trip to snowshoe yesterday and Shays in western territory was a nice longggg fun bump run! Speaking of weather, incoming winter storm in canaan tuesday, 3-6" pow! You know what to do!!!
shays at the shoe yesterday! empty lift lines bumps galore! :)
eggraid wrote:
Interesting to hear that about Liberty. I agree, they do have the best, most consistent bumps around. I wish more resorts would allow bumps to form on lower-angle trails so people can practice without going straight to the toughest trails on the mountain.
Nice! Spring bumps on lower shays are always fun.
chaga wrote:
Liberty always had bumps even 30+ years ago! Awesome place. good to hear its still got some character. :) Made a quick day trip to snowshoe yesterday and Shays in western territory was a nice longggg fun bump run! Speaking of weather, incoming winter storm in canaan tuesday, 3-6" pow! You know what to do!!!
shays at the shoe yesterday! empty lift lines bumps galore! :)
Snowmaking all day yesterday, Feb. 17, at Massanutten. Continued all night all over the mountain. It was a bit weird that snowmaking continued even in the teaching area until about 10am.
The skiing today was MUCH better than yesterday. Oddly, wasn't as crowded as Saturday afternoon.
We skied at Bryce yesterday (going back this weekend) and the conditions were amazing! Snow guns were back on last night and still going at of 7:34am Tuesday morning.
Hopefully all the resorts can weather the next warm up and make it until mid March.
Here’s a rare post that doesn’t reference Massanutten! No slush at HV.
Props to HV, 7S, and Laurel snowmaking operations for making the most of what _was_ an unimpressive winter. Maybe better than last year, but not by much. There were several times when Laurel was open enough to be the special place that we all know it is. HV woke up and started making snow at every opportunity at the end of January, and 7S, as much as their snowmaking snow is bashed, seemed, at least to me, to have great snow last sunny wednesday. As much as I'd like to ski one more weekend at HV, I think I'm done for the season.
Is this the end of the season? Repeated rain and warm temperatures?
Was hoping to bring my 7 year old son to Timberline for the first on Tuesday, March 5. I think they will survive these days but 60 degrees is going to be a true spring ski day for him. Thoughts?
Same for TL and LM. I happened to look at the Snowshoe cams and it looks like hell on Earth with about 5 people skiing.
I'm not at all confident that I will be using my last 2 days on my Epic local pass. After today and Fri, temps do not appear to dip below freezing for the next week.
Leo wrote:
7S and HV had to close today because of lightening and rain.....so that's a good encapsulation of the entire winter if there ever was.
odd weather tonight. if HV/7S are feeling frisky, opportunity to make snow.
... but I would assume "spring operations" from here on out, as far as HV 7S and Laurel are concerned.
The last PA Freestyle event at 7S has been announced as moved to Snowshoe because of concern about coverage and ability to keep their park open. So that can't be great news.
needawax wrote:
odd weather tonight. if HV/7S are feeling frisky, opportunity to make snow.
It’s might be too windy to make snow overnight even if the temperature drops. I think I just saw a cow fly by.
Keystone is currently selling tickets through April 7. So I think they will be open that week. From what I understand elk migration is getting later and later each year.
snowsmith wrote:
I cancelled my New Hampshire trip scheduled for next week. I am now scheduling a trip to Arapaho Basin and Breckenridge for early April. I was told that Keystone is closing on April 1 because of elk migration requirements so no skiing there? Anyway, based on long range weather forecasts for the East, I think our ski season hear in DcSki country and even New England will end shortly, unfortunately. All we can do is hope for better weather next season. If California can get lots of rain, we can get a lot of cold.
I am holding out hope that Killington will still be OK next Monday and Tuesday when I am there. They closed a bunch of trails this morning due to the hard freeze but hopefully as things warm up they will be able to open some stuff back up.
For Gore in NY on Wednesday and Thursday I have no expectations.
Looks like Whitetail is shutting down March 10th
Before Vail bought the place, Keystone - all three mountains - stayed open thru the first Sunday in May - like Loveland.
i skied many last days of the season in powder in the Outback.
rbrtlav wrote:
Keystone is currently selling tickets through April 7. So I think they will be open that week. From what I understand elk migration is getting later and later each year.
snowsmith wrote:
I cancelled my New Hampshire trip scheduled for next week. I am now scheduling a trip to Arapaho Basin and Breckenridge for early April. I was told that Keystone is closing on April 1 because of elk migration requirements so no skiing there? Anyway, based on long range weather forecasts for the East, I think our ski season hear in DcSki country and even New England will end shortly, unfortunately. All we can do is hope for better weather next season. If California can get lots of rain, we can get a lot of cold.
Not done at Hidden Valley. Blowing snow as of 22.50 on leap day!
Yesterday was a great day of skiing at Timberline. The season closing is getting closer but I think they still have until the 16th in them with reduced trails.
My son loved Timberline and skied the blacks like a champ and got praise from two passing by adults which he loved.
Skied Timberline today, probably one of the best spring skiing days I've ever had in the past 30 years of skiing. The snow was setup perfect in the morning, and gradually melted nicely. Hero snow wall to wall. Foggy and mist in the early AM turning into a really nice sunny afternoon. Place was a ghost town.
They built up a really sizeable base, it was impressive. They will have to close a few runs, but they can probably last another week.
Someone posted this in a Snowshoe Facebook group.
Looks like NWS estimates 8.5" for Snowshoe now. Had to leave last night so missed this but on my way to Mammoth & Tahoe.
Laurel Hill Crazie wrote:
Laurel just announced that operations will continue this Monday through Friday 12 to 8 PM. Wildcat still has good cover.
They are making snow at LM! So 7S and HV will be closed this week and LM will be open . That’s a switch.
snowsmith wrote:
Laurel Hill Crazie wrote:
Laurel just announced that operations will continue this Monday through Friday 12 to 8 PM. Wildcat still has good cover.They are making snow at LM! So 7S and HV will be closed this week and LM will be open . That’s a switch.
I just posted this on the Support Laurel FB Group:
Well, this season sees a first for Laurel. Seven Springs will close after today and reopen next weekend. Laurel will stay open midweek. I always thought Wildcat could draw expert and advanced skiers late in the season. Thanks to our mountain ops team for a record season, continuous operations beyond Seven Springs. Mountain ops is making snow as we speak. How are they doing that when the air compressors are gone? Laurel has a few big fan cannons that have their own onboard compressor. Thanks, Brett Cook and Vail for showing Laurel some love.
Am at Snowshoe currently, unfortunately have to leave today. Got here Thursday night. Friday was slushy spring skiing with temps in the 50s, Saturday was a washout, yesterday it was windy and snowed all day and night. Great powder day yesterday (only the summit was windswept). It’s sunny and windy now, conditions should be great today. Here’s a pic from yesterday afternoon. Everything that was icy/bare/slush on Friday and Saturday has been covered by freshly fallen snow and they were making snow on some trails all day yesterday as well. Should make for good conditions for the next few days.
What was the state of moguls? On Lower Shay's?
Sporttracski wrote:
Am at Snowshoe currently, unfortunately have to leave today. Got here Thursday night. Friday was slushy spring skiing with temps in the 50s, Saturday was a washout, yesterday it was windy and snowed all day and night. Great powder day yesterday (only the summit was windswept). It’s sunny and windy now, conditions should be great today. Here’s a pic from yesterday afternoon. Everything that was icy/bare/slush on Friday and Saturday has been covered by freshly fallen snow and they were making snow on some trails all day yesterday as well. Should make for good conditions for the next few days.
Didn’t venture over to that side of the mountain, not an expert skier by any means and wanted to have a chill ski weekend with friends. The way the wind was hitting the mountain during the storm yesterday and with the continuing wind today means that side was/is hit by wind gusts and probably retained less snowfall while the other side is protected and probably has better conditions.
Stephen wrote:
What was the state of moguls? On Lower Shay's?
Sporttracski wrote:
Am at Snowshoe currently, unfortunately have to leave today. Got here Thursday night. Friday was slushy spring skiing with temps in the 50s, Saturday was a washout, yesterday it was windy and snowed all day and night. Great powder day yesterday (only the summit was windswept). It’s sunny and windy now, conditions should be great today. Here’s a pic from yesterday afternoon. Everything that was icy/bare/slush on Friday and Saturday has been covered by freshly fallen snow and they were making snow on some trails all day yesterday as well. Should make for good conditions for the next few days.
Every time I've been there for a snowfall, the snow conditions on the Western Territory were much worse than the other side. That's one thing that's always bugged me about Snowshoe. The nice side is just a short lip with a few turns and then flat after that, whereas the Western Territory has the only runs with a sustained pitch, but the snow often isn't that great. I remember before they put in the high speed lift it was a 20 minute lift ride, because of the long runout sections in the middle. At one point I declared that I was done with that lift, then shortly after they put in the high speed lift that dropped the time to 6 minutes. Snowshoe is nice for the village and a longer season compared to other local places. I'd prefer Timberline for capturing a storm. The only thing none of the other places can match for a quick day of skiing for me (within 3 hours) is the sustained pitch of moguls on Lower Shay's revenge. I'd prefer to use my ski days someway else rather than driving 6 hours in the day, unless I can get on those moguls, which is why I've been asking about them in this forum.
Sporttracski wrote:
Didn’t venture over to that side of the mountain, not an expert skier by any means and wanted to have a chill ski weekend with friends. The way the wind was hitting the mountain during the storm yesterday and with the continuing wind today means that side was/is hit by wind gusts and probably retained less snowfall while the other side is protected and probably has better conditions.
Stephen wrote:
What was the state of moguls? On Lower Shay's?
Sporttracski wrote:
Am at Snowshoe currently, unfortunately have to leave today. Got here Thursday night. Friday was slushy spring skiing with temps in the 50s, Saturday was a washout, yesterday it was windy and snowed all day and night. Great powder day yesterday (only the summit was windswept). It’s sunny and windy now, conditions should be great today. Here’s a pic from yesterday afternoon. Everything that was icy/bare/slush on Friday and Saturday has been covered by freshly fallen snow and they were making snow on some trails all day yesterday as well. Should make for good conditions for the next few days.
" ... I'd prefer to use my ski days someway else rather than driving 6 hours in the day ..."
✅😕 no cap
The Western Territory was the worst I have ever seen it today, and I was shocked they had parts of it open. Upper Cupp had only a 10-15' wide very, very thin and icy strip open and was borderline unskiable. Lower Cupp was ok. I don't see Upper Cupp surviving the warm weather this week.
Upper Shays was ok and had good cover, but Lower Shays was groomed out, and even though they were making snow, it was sheer ice from side to side and I do mean unskiable sheer ice. Two skiers in front of me sailed off the slope because they couldn't hold it. Shays can sometimes get bad, but I've never seen it like that. Hopefully the cats get a chance to turn it over tonight and break it up.
Thanks, that's very helpful. I'm looking to go up this week, thinking that snow on Sunday without being groomed for a few days could give me some bumps when it warms up later this week. Sounds unlikely at this point though.
The19thHole wrote:
The Western Territory was the worst I have ever seen it today, and I was shocked they had parts of it open. Upper Cupp had only a 10-15' wide very, very thin and icy strip open and was borderline unskiable. Lower Cupp was ok. I don't see Upper Cupp surviving the warm weather this week.
Upper Shays was ok and had good cover, but Lower Shays was groomed out, and even though they were making snow, it was sheer ice from side to side and I do mean unskiable sheer ice. Two skiers in front of me sailed off the slope because they couldn't hold it. Shays can sometimes get bad, but I've never seen it like that. Hopefully the cats get a chance to turn it over tonight and break it up.
Friend at Snowshoe just texted (tues @ 1pm) me upper and lower Shays, and lower Cupp good. Upper Cupp closed.
Wintergreen closed on March 8.
Massanutten still open with only Southern Comfort and Showtime as of March 13.
Glad you got up to Killington. I was there a couple weeks ago and I agree Outer Limits is awesome. I am not nearly as far along in my mogul ability as you are. I could string together 3 or 4 good turns and I would slip up and need to reset. Any issues in technique get exposed quickly. I needed to work on staying centered and keeping my upper body facing downhill.
By the end of the 4 day trip (killington and gore) I could feel things coming together a bit. One really fun run at Gore was The Rumor, which has a short steep section at the top and then a somewhat steep section with moguls that were perfect for practicing.
It would be great to be able to get up there more.
Hey Grumpy dad, I got called out multiple times this season on this site for being too grumpy, but I pretty much agree with everything you just said. The only exception (and it's barely one) is that they paid slightly more attention to LM than Nutting did. So there was small, incremental improvement there compared to historical norms.
But HV is a joke. There were countless times they could have made snow and didn't. Or had a handful of guns on. Then as the season was winding down, when it was absolutely too little too late, they sort of kind of tried hard a few odd nights. My theory there is that it was to bait the poor local customers into feeling OK about getting ready to pay for NEXT YEAR'S pass when this year's was practically worthless.
And yes, not to sound old and too grumpy, but 7S has become a frat party where Vail clearly has no interest in stopping the rampant drinking and crime. It's OK on weekdays, that's about it. And you still might get your catalytic converter stolen even on a weekday! Bonus!
Grumpy dad wrote:
meanwhile, the suckers that own property at Hidden Valley - sure have a nice set of hills and unused equipment to look at. Open for all of 2 months really and not really fully other than a month. Open at Xmas with less terrain than I have in my backyard, packing them in like sardines, finally opening up the rest of the mountain and before you know it calling it quits, all while having the best snowmaking equipment that money can buy - vastly superior than 7Springs. But they dont like to operate it as those fan guns require a minimum amount of pressure and water to operate, while at 7Springs they can do snowmaking theater and operate the HKD towers with almost no volume.
Vail ownership is a plague to the planet. Plastic smiling creepy execs that have ZERO background in the ski industry.
Thank god Snowshoe is operated by a much better organization.
This winter sucked (AGAIN!) for weather, and Im sure the hard workers at 7Springs tried their best to make due with what they were given, but anyone that believes for 1 second that they maximized their snow making opportunities is incorrect. As someone that is local to 7S, I can tell you that anyone with half a brain could see the VAST difference in the effort put forward to open more terrain or put down a thicker base.
7Springs has become a drinking club. The last time I visited their little bowling alley, only 2 lanes were working and one was even kinda finicky. They said they were trying to get vail to allow them to send someone out for months, but it wasnt in budget so...
Vail cares about season passes, and alcoholics. That's it.
Note that every ski area in our lovely mid-Atlantic banana belt is closed. Except Snowshoe which has 1,800+ feet of additional elevation on our little mole hills. Similarly, many ski resorts in the mid-West have closed because of this years weather.
Grumps - your assertion that they did not make snow when the weather allowed for it is just not based on any fact. I track the weather closely, and the wet bulb temperature definitely limited when they could make snow. You can offer any opinion you want but you present no facts what so ever.
I think the problem is really not when they make snow, but the snow making system. HV does not have enough snow making capacity to overcome the weather. Look at Roundtop, Whitetail, and Liberty and perhaps even Massanuten. They have double the number of fixed snow guns as HV. 7S has a incredible compressed air system. And they can crank it out. But if you can't keep your base, then you spend most of your snow making effort replenishing the base on your core trails rather than opening new terrain. Similarly, the new Timberline invested heavily in a brand new airless snowmaking system. With the new system and, 1,200 feet of additional elevation, they were able to keep most of the mountain open for the season.
The endless carping and complaining about Vail gets old. They make snow when they can. And this year everyone knows that the opportunities were limited....except you guys. If you want to complain that the snowmaking system at HV does not have the capacity to overcome bad weather years, I think you are justified. I think Vail really used the snowmaking system at LM to the fullest extent this year. They kept their core trails open after a late opening. I was impressed what they accomplished. HV spent most of their snow making effort this year keep the core trails open with enough base to sustain viable skiing.
With the climate changing, I think that HV now has weather more similar to the old Roundtop than to the old Hidden Valley. Thus HV needs to add capacity if they're going to get more terrain open and keep it open. Does HV do enough business to make the investment worthwhile? I don't have an answer to that question. I only know we have had 4 different owners in the 19 years I have owned at HV.
As far as 7S being a party mountain, no different than when Nutting owned it. It has always been the mountain for the masses.
Snowshoe is one of the highest ski resorts in the east. The only ones higher are further south in NC, go figure. The jet stream also dips down in that area, so Timberline and Snowshoe really have an advantage and do much better with conditions.
I was riding the Highlands lift up Wintergreen many years ago, and a guy on the lift pointed to the mountain face on the right and said, "Wintergreen needs to put trails all down that face."
I said, "Wintergreen struggles to get open what they already have. It's hard to imagine them supporting that many more trails in the sun."
He said, "I'm on the board (or something like that) and Wintergreen has just expanded snowmaking. Snowmaking will never be a problem again." Fast forward a decade or so, and things are even worse now than before the snowmaking expansion. It really has been a race to see if the resorts can upgrade their snowmaking faster than the local climate has been changing. Those that didn't make the decision to upgrade are now barely able to open.
Is this the face where Outer Limits is? For sure they have struggled to get that one open the last couple of years.
Stephen wrote:
I was riding the Highlands lift up Wintergreen many years ago, and a guy on the lift pointed to the mountain face on the right and said, "Wintergreen needs to put trails all down that face."
I said, "Wintergreen struggles to get open what they already have. It's hard to imagine them supporting that many more trails in the sun."
This guy was pushing to put in a bunch more trails to the right of Outer Limits (when looking up the slope). It would be like how Massanutten put in Mueller's Mile. I'm amazed that Massanutten could support so much surface area in the sun like that.
When Outer Limits first opened we had a bunch of good years with natural snow fall, and it was a really fun mogul trail for many weeks. Then it faded away and hasn't been the same since.
wgo wrote:
Is this the face where Outer Limits is? For sure they have struggled to get that one open the last couple of years.
Stephen wrote:
I was riding the Highlands lift up Wintergreen many years ago, and a guy on the lift pointed to the mountain face on the right and said, "Wintergreen needs to put trails all down that face."
I said, "Wintergreen struggles to get open what they already have. It's hard to imagine them supporting that many more trails in the sun."
They are. At a whooping summit elevation of 1,500 ft. Fascinating.
imp wrote:
Blue mountain is to make snow last night?
bob wrote:
One of my favorite memories of skiing the Mid Atlantic was a long time ago when I skied an April morning at Blue and then did 9 holes of golf in the afternoon in Reading.
I play a fair amount of golf in the summer in VA. I could easily do a same-day ski/golf combo here in UT anytime in the next two months. It's just kind of hard to justify the recreational gluttony of it :-) But I might do it this spring just to say I did.
There is one thing better than that. Skiing a Labor Day weekend morning at Timberline Oregon, and then driving to the coast, sitting on the beach slurping clam chowder while the sun sets over the Pacific..
Did that two times.
JimK wrote:
bob wrote:
One of my favorite memories of skiing the Mid Atlantic was a long time ago when I skied an April morning at Blue and then did 9 holes of golf in the afternoon in Reading.I play a fair amount of golf in the summer in VA. I could easily do a same-day ski/golf combo here in UT anytime in the next two months. It's just kind of hard to justify the recreational gluttony of it :-) But I might do it this spring just to say I did.
Leo and Grumpy Dad, I get the issues you have with HV. That
said, I am a homeowner at HV and also board member on one of its community
foundations. I'm not entirely sure if I'm a "sucker" as described so eloquently
by Grumpy Dad, but my wife and I spend most of our time there in the summer and
autumn; the pools are nice, I enjoy a round of golf a least once a week, and overall,
it’s a good community. From my vantage point, Vail Resorts, Inc. has been
rather ambivalent about their commitment and investments to the HV ski area,
which is a problem. Additionally, as it relates to this past season, the
team responsible for snowmaking and grooming worked very hard but was
relatively inexperienced. To make matters worese, roughly 15-20% of the fixed TechnoAlpin fan guns are
currently inoperable… not a good combination for marginal weather conditions. I’m
hoping for a better future for the ski area, but the current MTS business model
is not favorable for ski resorts the size of HV.
Leo wrote:
Hey Grumpy dad, I got called out multiple times this season on this site for being too grumpy, but I pretty much agree with everything you just said. The only exception (and it's barely one) is that they paid slightly more attention to LM than Nutting did. So there was small, incremental improvement there compared to historical norms.
But HV is a joke. There were countless times they could have made snow and didn't. Or had a handful of guns on. Then as the season was winding down, when it was absolutely too little too late, they sort of kind of tried hard a few odd nights. My theory there is that it was to bait the poor local customers into feeling OK about getting ready to pay for NEXT YEAR'S pass when this year's was practically worthless.
And yes, not to sound old and too grumpy, but 7S has become a frat party where Vail clearly has no interest in stopping the rampant drinking and crime. It's OK on weekdays, that's about it. And you still might get your catalytic converter stolen even on a weekday! Bonus!
Grumpy dad wrote:
meanwhile, the suckers that own property at Hidden Valley - sure have a nice set of hills and unused equipment to look at. Open for all of 2 months really and not really fully other than a month. Open at Xmas with less terrain than I have in my backyard, packing them in like sardines, finally opening up the rest of the mountain and before you know it calling it quits, all while having the best snowmaking equipment that money can buy - vastly superior than 7Springs. But they dont like to operate it as those fan guns require a minimum amount of pressure and water to operate, while at 7Springs they can do snowmaking theater and operate the HKD towers with almost no volume.
Vail ownership is a plague to the planet. Plastic smiling creepy execs that have ZERO background in the ski industry.
Thank god Snowshoe is operated by a much better organization.
This winter sucked (AGAIN!) for weather, and Im sure the hard workers at 7Springs tried their best to make due with what they were given, but anyone that believes for 1 second that they maximized their snow making opportunities is incorrect. As someone that is local to 7S, I can tell you that anyone with half a brain could see the VAST difference in the effort put forward to open more terrain or put down a thicker base.
7Springs has become a drinking club. The last time I visited their little bowling alley, only 2 lanes were working and one was even kinda finicky. They said they were trying to get vail to allow them to send someone out for months, but it wasnt in budget so...
Vail cares about season passes, and alcoholics. That's it.
If Snowshoe's still open, then the season isn't over in the Mid-Atlantic!
Snowshoe's season is due to end on Easter Sunday this year, and I think they'll make it.
The fact that Western's still open is pretty amazing since it catches lots of wind and the pm sun.
💯let's add a blackend salmon (NOT gross wild caught oil-fish ick) and a bottle of Willamette Pinot yeah!
bob wrote:
There is one thing better than that. Skiing a Labor Day weekend morning at Timberline Oregon, and then driving to the coast, sitting on the beach slurping clam chowder while the sun sets over the Pacific..
Did that two times.
Shoeing it Fri-Sun to finish out the season.
I'll be in a blue vest finishing out my hours for the winter.
I know it's Easter, but the Mtns. are calling!
On my Youtube channel, someone told me there were no moguls yesterday. "Front side started off amazing but Shays was apparently a sheet of ice" then softened up.
Cold nights, warm days... I keep looking for moguls, and then I'd go up... I'm getting a new pair of skis, and if they arrive before Snowshoe shuts down, then I"ll go up no matter what, but I wouldn't bother with Shay's unless it's warmed up.
I keep watching the grooming report, and they show Shay's groomed everyday. But, does that mean across the entire slope? I figure with Cupp closed, they have to give that top to bottom, wide, groomed run in the Western Territory for the carving zealots that probably complain louder than I do if it's not groomed. So I've been doubtful there are any bumps. I'll bet that means not a single bump on the entire mountain. So sad for spring skiing to have no bumps. I'll call it pathetic. Though, should I bow in appreciation that they are the only mountain still open within a 3 hours drive? There have been lots of cold nights. Would have been easy to give us a mogul run. It doesn't have to be double black either. That's what these local places don't seem to understand. A blue mogul run is entirely acceptable, even more desirable at times, and certainly more useful for the general population to get better at mogul skiing. People ski it and like it. End of rant, for now.
wgo wrote:
May head up Friday if they can keep lower Shays open. Any on the ground reports? Lower ballhooter not looking great on the cams.
I was there sunday....ghost town. they had to groom it because it was grass between bumps the previous sunday. Makes sense to me. woulda liked the bumps but its spring after a marginal winter so surprised they were even open. Barely open, but open. Most restaraunts and stuff are shutdown now also. Was a great quiet bluebird day to be a tourist at another resort town nearby! We had a blast!!
snowshoe legend george bell!
whitegrass legend chipper chase!
upper shays
trying to stop the closure of the tavern! last day of spruce tavern.... dont blame em tho, they raised the rent to $8000/mo. who can afford that aside from Blackrock?!
the spruce taproom you speak of is staying, and they plan to sell food out of it after some renovation.
wgo wrote:
Thanks for the report and pics. Bummer about the Spruce Tavern. I always liked going to their smaller location just across from to top of Ballhooter lift for a quick beer at the end of the day.
chaga wrote:
I was there sunday....ghost town. they had to groom it because it was grass between bumps the previous sunday. Makes sense to me. woulda liked the bumps but its spring after a marginal winter so surprised they were even open. Barely open, but open. Most restaraunts and stuff are shutdown now also. Was a great quiet bluebird day to be a tourist at another resort town nearby! We had a blast!!
snowshoe legend george bell!
whitegrass legend chipper chase!
upper shays
trying to stop the closure of the tavern! last day of spruce tavern.... dont blame em tho, they raised the rent to $8000/mo. who can afford that aside from Blackrock?!
Good to see George out! Thanks for sharing.
Nope. Not groomed. But no moguls forming (was out there today)
Stephen wrote:
Snowshoe not only hasn't used the grooming symbol on Lower Shay's, but they call it out as ungroomed in their Daily Message. More moguls before it's over?
I wanted to get up there on Friday, but couldn't get away. They said it was groomed. I was going to go up this morning groomed or not, but didn't after I saw Shay's was closed. That's all folks.
wgo wrote:
Nope. Not groomed. But no moguls forming (was out there today)
Stephen wrote:
Snowshoe not only hasn't used the grooming symbol on Lower Shay's, but they call it out as ungroomed in their Daily Message. More moguls before it's over?
Conditions were great today inWV if you didn't mind hiking a little bit.
By the way Wgo, how was that last day you had at Snowshoe. Was it worthwhile?
wgo wrote:
Nope. Not groomed. But no moguls forming (was out there today)
Stephen wrote:
Snowshoe not only hasn't used the grooming symbol on Lower Shay's, but they call it out as ungroomed in their Daily Message. More moguls before it's over?
Is that allowed?
Brook wrote:
I'd say it was worthwhile. I hadn't skied since the first week of March and was feeling my season got cut short so when I got the chance for a final day I took it. Felt like actual winter with snow covered roads on the final part of the drive. First couple hours were nice and lower shays was in easy mode but still fun. After that things got really, really sticky so I cut things a bit short and headed home. I needed to be back home by around 5 pm anyway.
Stephen wrote:
By the way Wgo, how was that last day you had at Snowshoe. Was it worthwhile?
wgo wrote:
Nope. Not groomed. But no moguls forming (was out there today)
Stephen wrote:
Snowshoe not only hasn't used the grooming symbol on Lower Shay's, but they call it out as ungroomed in their Daily Message. More moguls before it's over?
Brook wrote:
Conditions were great today inWV if you didn't mind hiking a little bit.
thats usually all we ever do when there's some natural. It was a good elevation snow with about 10" above 4000' and like 4" at base of valley in canaan. Friday afternoon/eve was great, and Sat morning. but turned thicker by saturday afternoon with temps in mid 30s. Heck the whole time it snowed it was like hovering near freezing.
Way to go and get out there and get after it! A great ending to best season in 6 years
"Located in Canaan Heights, WV, the official name of this weather station assigned by the National Weather Service is Davis 3SE, indicating it is located 3 miles southeast of the town of Davis, WV. Snowfall observations at this location began in the fall of 2001, and it became an official National Weather Service Cooperative Observer Program (COOP) weather station on July 1, 2002. At an elevation of 3715 feet, this weather station is higher in elevation than all 500+ COOP stations in New York, Pennsylvania, Virginia, and West Virginia, except for the station located at Snowshoe, WV.
imp wrote:
where is this measured??
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